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Post by hollygail on Sept 16, 2016 3:45:40 GMT
Welcome!!! You have entered a space where all people are invited to gather to discuss matters of Spirituality, in mutual respect and friendliness: "Considering...Spirituality." Here, the focus is on personal spirituality and not dogma. We welcome with open arms people from any, all, and no religious/faith backgrounds, and those who practice spirituality on their own, to join us for a discussion centered on a higher consciousness. Each day there will be a quote, question, or discussion prompt presented for all to ponder and respond to.
**In maintaining an atmosphere of comfort and trust, we do not allow proselytizing (the effort of trying to convert others) or the denigrating of the religions and viewpoints of others. We also avoid bringing up topics such as politics, hot button social issues, or anything that can be considered divisive**
As this is a WW board, we also discuss our personal wellness, including our weight management program. We share our struggles and our triumphs regarding such as well as discuss things like family, friends, jobs, hobbies, outside interests, etc... We strive to build each other up with loving support in a positive manner. Let us not ever tear one another down in any way, shape or form.
Regular thread starters for the time being are:
Sunday, Monday, Tuesday: Gary
Wednesday, Thursday, Friday: Holly
Yet if anyone is so inclined, please feel free to start a new thread by beginning with the title: "Considering....(topic -q/q)", post this introduction (by way of copy & paste) then follow that with a post putting forth a question and/or quote (with or without some explanation) for us to ponder today. The topic can be inspired by your personal faith, but please do remember that anyone from other spiritual paths should be able to answer it.
Shalom, Love & Light, Blessed Be, Namaste...
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Post by hollygail on Sept 16, 2016 3:48:02 GMT
This week, the selection from the Prophets that we’re reading (to go along with Deuteronomy 21: – 25:19, which we talked about yesterday) is from Isaiah 54:1–10, in which Israel, likened to a barren woman, is promised countless children.
"In slight anger, for a moment,
I hid My face from you;
But with kindness everlasting
I will take you back in love." (Isaiah 54:8)
This heartfelt promise from God to Israel represents the overall message of reconciliation conveyed in this week’s selection. One of the seven readings of consolation read between Tisha B’Av and Rosh Hashanah, this one conveys a powerful, comforting message in a small number of verses (and my students who are lucky enough to become bar or bat mitzvah on the Sabbath this is read are incredibly lucky; most selections are in the neighborhood of 24–26 verses, while this one is 10!).
In the first three verses, an exiled Israel is compared to a woman who has never experienced the pleasure of bearing a child. "Shout, O barren one!" (54:1), it opens, instructing this metaphorical woman to cry out in joyful celebration because she will soon be blessed with children. She is told to enlarge the size of her tent to make room for all the children she will have.
In the middle section, verses 4 through 8, Isaiah describes how God will bring Israel back to God in mercy. Earlier, Israel was a barren woman. Now, Israel is described as a widow who lost her husband (God), but she is promised that she will "remember no more the shame of your widowhood" (54:4). In the next verses she is described as a third kind of woman — one whose husband left her, forlorn and forsaken. She is promised that her husband (again, God) will take her back in love.
The last two verses strengthen God’s message by comparing it to the covenant with Noah in the Book of Genesis. Back then, God promised that God would never again flood the earth; now God pledges never again to be angry with or rebuke Israel. Even if the mountains move and the hills are shaken, God’s covenant will stand firm.
q/qs:
1. Many of the Prophets use metaphor to get their point across. In your spiritual path, what part does metaphor play (if any)?
2. The emphasis on childbearing was considerably (no pun intended) more important in ancient times when people fought for survival. If you have children, how important to you was it to become a parent? If you don’t have children, do you feel you’ve missed out? And if so, do you think you are somehow “less than” people who have had children?
3. Other comments you may have on this reading?
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Post by glrogers67 on Sept 16, 2016 17:00:50 GMT
Holly, did you hear about the oldest man in the world who received his bar mitzvah at age 113?
If I understand the use of metaphor correctly, it is using familiar objects or people to explain spiritual principles. Our prophets use stories all the time to teach spiritual principles. Christ used parables extensively in His teaching. To the spiritually enlightened these stories contained deeper meanings; to those not spiritually enlightened they were just nice stories. The Book of Mormon contains a classic metaphor, or as the scriptures describe it - an allegory, about tame and wild olive trees and how they represent the scattering and gathering of Israel.
As for children, consider Psalm 127:3-5
3 Lo, children are an heritage of the Lord: and the fruit of the womb is his reward.
4 As arrows are in the hand of a mighty man; so are children of the youth.
5 Happy is the man that hath his quiver full of them: they shall not be ashamed, but they shall speak with the enemies in the gate.
I know motherhood is next to Godliness. We lost our first baby to a stillbirth. It was devastating to my ex-wife. She mourned the loss of that first baby for years, probably still does, and it probably contributed to her mental illnesses over the years. It also was a contributing factor in our divorce. She was so focused upon our girls and our grandchildren that she neglected the marriage. Don't get me wrong. I totally love my girls and my grandchildren, but perhaps not with the obsession that she had.
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Post by hollygail on Sept 16, 2016 17:16:17 GMT
Yes, Gary, DH sent me a link to his story.
Please tell me about the olives metaphor.
I'm off for an appointment; will be back in several hours, then off again.
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Post by glrogers67 on Sept 16, 2016 20:17:32 GMT
The metaphor, or allegory, of the olive trees is a somewhat lengthy passage from the Book of Mormon in which a BOM prophet named Jacob quotes another prophet, Zenos, who is mentioned several times in the Book of Mormon but, strangely enough, there is no Book of Zenos in the Book of Mormon. It is listed in the Guide to the Scriptures as one of the lost scriptures, mentioned in other scriptures which we don't currently have.
Anyway, rather than copy the entire allegory here I will quote from a student manual on the Book of Mormon. If you want to read it for yourself the Book of Mormon is readily available on LDS.org, and the allegory begins in Jacob chapter 5:
Jacob quotes an allegory from Zenos, a Hebrew prophet mentioned several times in the Book of Mormon. An allegory is a literary device in which one object or event is used to describe or represent another. Zenos’s allegory uses olive trees to summarize Israel’s history and foretell its destiny.
The allegory begins with the master of the vineyard finding that his tame olive tree is beginning to decay (Jacob 5:3–4). What does this decay represent? (Apostasy.) What did the master of the vineyard do when he found his tame olive tree decaying? (See Jacob 5:4–14. You may need to explain that grafting is a process in which part of a second plant is joined to a first plant in such a way that it becomes a permanent part of the first plant.) Why did the master ask the servant to graft in some wild branches? (See Jacob 5:11, 18.)
••What does grafting represent in this allegory? (Bringing Gentiles into the house of Israel through baptism.) When was the gospel first taken to the Gentiles? (See Acts 10.)
••What is represented by transplanting the tame branches into distant parts of the vineyard? (See 1 Nephi 10:12–13.) What specific groups might these tame branches represent? (See 1 Nephi 2:19–20; 22:3–4.) Why was Israel scattered? (See Amos 9:8–9.)
••The master of the vineyard repeatedly worked with his servant to prune, dig about, and nourish his tree. What does this suggest about Jesus Christ’s involvement in the lives of His people?
••When the master visited the vineyard for the second time, what did he discover about the wild branches that were grafted into the tame tree? (See Jacob 5:15–18.) What does the bearing of good fruit symbolize? How can new converts add life and strength to the Church?
••What did the master find when he visited the natural (tame) branches he had planted in various places around the vineyard? (See Jacob 5:19–25. Point out that the branches planted in poor ground brought forth good fruit, while the branches planted in good ground yielded both good and wild fruit.) What application might these situations have for us today?
••When the master visited the vineyard the third time, what had happened to all the fruit? (See Jacob 5:29–32, 37–42.) What do the many kinds of corrupt fruit symbolize? (Universal apostasy.) What caused the apostasy? (See Jacob 5:37, 40, 48.) What might the “loftiness” of the vineyard symbolize? How can our own loftiness, or pride, prevent us from bearing good fruit?
••What does the master’s response to his corrupted vineyard tell us about the Lord’s feelings for His people? (See Jacob 5:41, 47.) How does knowing that the Lord loves you make a difference in your life?
Zenos uses several symbols in this allegory:
Symbol
Meaning
Vineyard
The world
Master of the vineyard
Jesus Christ
Tame olive tree
The house of Israel, the Lord’s covenant people
Wild olive tree
Gentiles (people not born into the house of Israel)
Branches
Groups of people
Servants
Prophets and others called to serve
Fruit
Lives or works of people
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