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Post by hollygail on Aug 17, 2016 4:52:28 GMT
Welcome!! You have entered a space where all people are invited to gather to discuss matters of Spirituality, in mutual respect and friendliness: "Considering...Spirituality." Here, the focus is on personal spirituality and not dogma. We welcome with open arms people from any, all, and no religious/faith backgrounds, and those who practice spirituality on their own, to join us for a discussion centered on a higher consciousness. Each day there will be a quote, question, or discussion prompt presented for all to ponder and respond to.
**In maintaining an atmosphere of comfort and trust, we do not allow proselytizing (the effort of trying to convert others) or the denigrating of the religions and viewpoints of others. We also avoid bringing up topics such as politics, hot button social issues, or anything that can be considered divisive**
As this was a WW board, we also discuss our personal wellness, including our weight management program. We share our struggles and our triumphs regarding such as well as discuss things like family, friends, jobs, hobbies, outside interests, etc... We strive to build each other up with loving support in a positive manner. Let us not ever tear one another down in any way, shape or form.
Regular thread starters for the time being are:
Sunday, Monday, Tuesday: Gary / Wednesday, Thursday, Friday: Holly
Yet if anyone is so inclined, please feel free to start a new thread by beginning with the title: "Considering ... (topic)," post this introduction (by way of copy & paste) then follow that with a post putting forth a question and/or quote (with or without some explanation) for us to ponder today. The topic can be inspired by your personal faith, but please do remember that anyone from other spiritual paths should be able to answer it.
Shalom, Love & Light, Blessed Be, Namaste...
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Post by hollygail on Aug 17, 2016 5:49:45 GMT
Last week I told you about Tisha b'Av, the 9th of Av, the date that commemorates the destruction of the First (in 586 BCE by the Babylonians and Second (in 70CE by the Romans) Temples. This coming Friday is the 15th of Av. It's also a Jewish holiday, but of a totally different kind. Tu B'Av, the fifteenth day of the month of Av, is a Day of Love in Judaism.
The walls of Jerusalem have historically been a source of inspiration for romance and love. Thousands of years before anyone heard of Saint Valentine or Sadie Hawkins, the Jewish people created a Jerusalem-centered love festival for couples. This custom is quite in keeping with the sensuous poetry of the Song of Songs, canonized in the Hebrew Scriptures.
In the glow of a full summer moon, on Tu b'Av (the 15th of Av), young women, robed in white, would dance in the fields outside the walls of Jerusalem. The men would follow in hopes of finding a bride. Coming one week after Tisha B’Av, the saddest day of the Jewish year, Tu b’Av is celebrated outside of the walls of the city, away from the Temple Mount, the site of the destruction.
Whereas Tisha B’Av is the day when (according to tradition) God declared that the Jews would wander 40 years in the desert (until the generation that knew slavery died out), Tu B’Av is the day when, 40 years later, the remaining 15,000 Israelites of the desert generation were told they would be able to enter the Promised Land. God was able to forgive the Jewish people on this day, even for the sin of having built and worshiped a Golden Calf.
In the Talmud we read that Rabbi Simeon ben Gamliel said there never were in Israel greater days of joy than the 15th of Av and the Day of Atonement. On these days the daughters of Jerusalem used to walk out in white garments (that they borrowed in order not to put to shame anyone who didn't have one). The unmarried women danced in the vineyards exclaiming, “Young man, lift up your eyes and see what you choose for yourself. Do not set your eyes on beauty but set them on good family. Grace is deceitful and beauty is vain. But a woman in awe of God, she will be praised.”
Why did Rabbi Simeon link Tu B’Av and Yom Kippur? The answer says a lot about Judaism’s unique perspective on relationships, a perspective that could perhaps enhance courtship today.
Tu B’Av, like Yom Kippur, is about introspection and new beginnings concerning our relationships and personal values. How courting was done is indicative of this view. The young girls borrowed white dresses so that the young men could not choose among them according to materialistic concerns. The Talmud teaches that women set the rules; the women admonish their suitors to pick not according to beauty, but by the good name of the women’s families and by their awe of God. Today we live in a world that is status- and fashion-conscious, a world of beauty pageants and beauty ideals set by television and movies.
Tu B’Av tells us to look beneath the surface when looking for (or at) a life partner, just as Yom Kippur forces us to look deep into ourselves before God grants us life anew. Like Yom Kippur, Tu B’Av is a time for reflection and introspection. But instead of being an individual process, it is a mutual, shared experience between two people.
Tu B’Av is a great day for weddings, commitment ceremonies, renewal of vows, or proposing. It is a day for enhancing current relationships or defining anew what you are looking for in a partner. It is a day for romance, explored through singing, dancing, giving flowers, and studying.
q/q:
1.Do you find yourself more in awe of the material than the spiritual? (at least sometimes?) Isn't the material fairly seductive, perhaps even more so than the spiritual? What's wrong with the concept of "marrying money"?
2. In your personal life, how do you view "romantic" love? What connection do you draw between romantic love and spirituality?
And Gary, I'm hoping you and your GF are speaking on the phone by Friday. Wouldn't that be just a little more romantic? [sigh]
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Post by hollygail on Aug 17, 2016 5:57:02 GMT
[Note: that last line, beginning "And Gary..." was supposed to be in a separate paragraph from q/q #2]
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Post by fabulessme on Aug 17, 2016 15:59:35 GMT
q/q: 1.Do you find yourself more in awe of the material than the spiritual? (at least sometimes?) Isn't the material fairly seductive, perhaps even more so than the spiritual? What's wrong with the concept of "marrying money"? 2. In your personal life, how do you view "romantic" love? What connection do you draw between romantic love and spirituality? And Gary, I'm hoping you and your GF are speaking on the phone by Friday. Wouldn't that be just a little more romantic? [sigh] 1. Depends on what the material stuff is. There are some pretty cool things out there. But I usually lean toward spiritual. I find that its easier to focus on the spiritual vs. material as I get older. Marrying money...to me, that would be a business transaction more than it would be a spiritual union. 2. Romoantic love IMO does not work. Doesn't mean that I don't think that there should be romance in a relationship. But what we currently call romantic love is really a chemical/hormonal reaction. I think a relationship has better chances if its built on spirituality, friendship, common goals and yes, it should be romantic. Gary: I'm with Holly--hoping you get to dialogue again soon. |
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Post by glrogers67 on Aug 17, 2016 19:09:01 GMT
Actually, our relationship was based upon the spiritual from the beginning. The idea that men are more attracted to the physical is true, while women on the average seem more attracted to the feelings developed during a relationship. I have always believed women are more spiritual than men, with some exceptions of course. That is what attracted me to her to begin with - we developed a spiritual relationship before I ever knew what she looked like. We initially met online when she put out an advertisement for LDS pen pals. I responded, thinking I could teach a relatively new member of the church a few things - as it turns out she taught me far more than I ever taught her about spirituality. So now we are struggling primarily because I haven't advanced as fast spiritually as she would have liked. She is miles ahead of me in understanding the doctrines of the church even though she has only been a member about 15-16 years vs. my 44 years of membership. The romance came much later. I wouldn't hold my breath about her calling by Friday. I pray for that, but we still have issues we are discussing with texts and e-mails.
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